Episode 10 - Heidi Blair

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Welcome everyone to another episode of the Reformable Podcast, a podcast that brings you

people's stories and ideas about how we can work to reframe our relationship, not just with alcohol, but with stress, anxiety, relationships, enjoyment, and so much more. Because changing our relationship with alcohol is about so much more than changing the content of our glass.

In today's episode, we talk with Heidi Blair. Heidi is a certified professional co-active coach who has also furthered her training with an extensive mentorship program led by Marian Franklin, master certified coach and author of the Heart of Laser Focused Coaching, where she learned to readily identify a client's underlying root cause of established behaviors, patterns, and habits.

She started her own reframe journey in 2021 on the cutback track, and through using the app, attending meetings, and working with a coach, she created a successful cutback approach, which she now employs as a coaching modality for [00:01:00] those who want to change their relationship with alcohol, whether they're wanting to cut back, go alcohol free, or have yet to determine which track is right for them.

As a moderator here at Reframe, she leads many meetings each week where she offers a heart-based, compassionate approach to coach participants who may be stuck, struggling, or simply in need of being seen and have reflected back to them who they truly are. She shares with us her own journey and talks about employing different approaches to cutting back alcohol in our life and how important support is on this path.

My name is Kevin Beak. I'm a certified professional recovery coach and the head of coaching at the Reframe. This podcast is brought to you by the Reframe app. Reframe is the number one iOS app to help you cut back or quit drinking alcohol. It uses neuroscience to reframe your relationship with alcohol and unlock the healthiest, happiest you.

So without any further delay, let's go chat with Heidi.

Kevin: Welcome Heidi. How's it going today?

Heidi: I'm doing well, Kevin, how are you?

Kevin: [00:02:00] Good. yeah, can't complain. It's a Tuesday.

Although we just got off a Reframe meeting and we were talking to 'em. Somebody asked like, what day is it? And I'm like, I think it's Tuesday and they were like, oh, as long as it's not Monday again. And I'm like, well, Monday's typically been a good day for me now, and Tuesdays is my bad day because I'm like, is it not close enough to the weekend and it's still too early in the week, so maybe that's just me.

Heidi: Yeah. Well, you know how I feel about Monday, Kevin.

I love Monday. Monday I'm just gonna out myself. Yeah. I love Monday.

Kevin: Yeah, I found out on my own journey that, uh, Mondays aren't as bad as they were when I was drinking because obviously you wake up and you have to go to work and deal with all that stress. But, um, But yeah, so it's definitely changed over my time here on my own personal path but whatever, enough about Monday or Tuesday. Welcome everybody listening to this on Friday, uh, or any other day of the week. Heidi, if you'd like to [00:03:00] stop my rambling on the days of the week and if you wanna share a little bit about your story, uh, please feel free.

Heidi: Thanks, Kevin. I appreciate this, uh, opportunity. So, I wanna talk a little bit about my journey, which is a cutback journey, and I think I might be the first person sharing a cutback journey on this podcast. There we go. Okay. Yeah. So, um, a little background. Um, I was not, uh, a teenager who did any drinking or drugging, even though I was in high school in the mid to late seventies.

So I was a dork, um, for sure. Although I loved high school, I had a really good time. I just didn't do the partying piece right. My big sister was doing that, and, uh, I just chose not to, don't know why. College, same story, not really my thing. Um, I was a server. I worked in restaurants and bars through college and you know, [00:04:00] that just, just wasn't a choice I made. So this is just a background to kind of fast forward to when I did start drinking in an unhealthy way, right? So I got married in my twenties. I had three children in a row, 28, 29, 31. Had this, uh, little instant family, um, fast forward, uh, about 12 years later, and the marriage was unhealthy, I was unhappy.

And that's when I started, uh, you know, drowning my sorrows in Chardonnay, right? And it wasn't extreme at all to what people would've considered to be extreme. But, I started having anxiety and not from drinking just anxiety like in the middle of the day for no reason. Driving my kids home from the pumpkin patch, just crazy anxiety.

So of course [00:05:00] I sought help for that and they gave me pills. I said, they give you, they give you pills, um, and the pills work for a while, and the pills work better after a while if you wash them down with Chardonnay. So that's what I started doing. And then I wasn't sleeping, so they gave me pills for that.

So the short story here is that years of pills and Chardonnay trying to numb the pain and sadness of my crumbling marriage. That wasn't working either anymore at a certain point. And so I had a therapist, I had a psychiatrist, you know, I had all these things and none of it was working. And so this is my personal rock bottom.

I woke up one morning, I got out of bed. I looked out the window at our horses and my horses and my daughter's horses playing in the snow. And [00:06:00] it was beautiful when looking at the big red barn that I built and had all these animals in my life and what I'd always wanted since I was a little girl. And the thought inside my head was, fuck, I have to feed them.

And that triggered a whole wave of emotions, like, what in the hell is wrong with me? And then I called my therapist and I said, here's the deal. I'm just gonna stop taking all these pills. None of this is working. I just wanna know what it's like to do life without. Having all my feelings drugged out. Yeah.

And he said, well, you can't do that because with what you're taking, if you stop taking Klonopin for example, your heart will stop. I had no idea. So I said, well then I wanna go to the hospital and I wanna get detox that I wanna, you know. He goes, why don't you come in for a session? I went in for a session and he said, I think you should go to rehab.

And I [00:07:00] said, fine, you know, whatever works. He said, I think you should go to the Meadows in the desert in Arizona. I'm like, I hate the fucking desert. I'm not going to the desert to go to rehab. And he goes, well, what do you mean? I'm like, it's not me. I'll find a rehab. He goes, how are you gonna find it? I'm like, on the interwebs, right?

This is a long time ago. This was two thousand three. So I did, uh, he goes, well, you have to go this week. And I said, I, I can't go anywhere this week. He goes, well, if you don't go this week, you won't go. And I said, I will go. I just have to do this in my own time. I have six puppies to home. I have a Thanksgiving dinner to cook for my family and I have Christmas to get through.

On December 26th, I will go to rehab. He kind of wrote me off fine. I went home. I found this amazing place called Pavilion in uh, Mill Spring North Carolina, and I contacted them and I signed up to go on December 26th. Same kind of story on the other end. Wait a minute, you're not gonna come this week?

No, I'm not coming this week anyway. Um, I found a doctor [00:08:00] locally, she dosed me down off my meds, titrated me off of them slowly. And the day came December the 26th. I went to the airport. I got on the plane. I had two klon up and left. One for the first flight, one for the second flight to get me to South Carolina, where they'd pick me up from the center and take me and big snowstorm blizzard at Salt Lake City Airport, sitting on the tarmac over an hour, missing connections.

Everybody's missing connections. Woman runs up to the front of the plane. I was sitting in first class and said to the flight attendant, I think my husband's having a heart attack. And this is the day after Christmas. Were there any medical personnel on board? No, there were not small plane. I thought about it and I'm like, I'm pretty sure this guy's having a panic attack, right?

So I went to the flight attendant and I said, I have an idea. And I took my two blue pills out of my purse and I walked back and I looked at him and I said, is your heart beating out of your chest? His eyes were, I said, she feels like you can't breathe. [00:09:00] Everything's tight. I'm like, okay, you're gonna put this under your tongue and you're gonna stay with me for five minutes and then you're gonna feel calm.

You're gonna be okay. I think you're just having a panic attack. So he did, and he was fine. And we carried on and the flight was diverted to Cincinnati. None of this matters. What matters is I chose to give this guy one of my last two pills, and evidently that was significant. Did it seem significant to me at all?

It seemed like the human thing to do. Got to Cincinnati, thought, well, probably my last drink tonight. So I, uh, the bar was closed, it was late. And I said, is room service still open? Yes, it is. Great. Bring me your nicest bottle of Chardonnay. And I went up to my room and he said he was doing the room service that night.

So I went up to my room. I made a couple of phone calls and he knocked at the door and it had the little towel around it and said, here you go. Uh, do you want me to open it? And I said, no, no, I got it. So he left. Um, I [00:10:00] put it on the table, I took the towel off, I pulled it out, and it was a bottle of Glen Ellen. Wine snob.

Okay. Stuffed that thing right back in the ice, put the towel over it, went to bed, just didn't, wasn't, didn't care, wasn't gonna drink that shit. Yeah. So another funny thing that it didn't seem significant to me at the time, it became significant the next day when they did my intake. Okay. So intake is a big deal.

It takes hours, you know, long story short, at the end of my amazing six weeks in rehab, and yes, I went for six weeks because that was an option. And since I had been titrating down, they knew. That I wasn't gonna sleep in the beginning, which I didn't pretty much for 10 solid nights awake with my thoughts and wow, what a trip that was.

Anyway, [00:11:00] I went to rehab. I figured out a lot of things and although when you leave rehab, you're not supposed to go home and make big changes in your life. My counselor, my personal therapist while I was there, called me into her office cuz they do family week and your spouse comes out for the week and then they put them through the paces, right?

Hmm. She called me into her office, she goes, you know that little meeting where they told you not to make any big changes, like leave your spouse and stuff like that? And I said, yeah. She goes, doesn't apply to you. Okay, thanks. Because what I needed was to get out of my very unhappy marriage. What I needed was to find who I was and I got a glimpse of that by sitting in the front of the class and raising my hand in rehab just like I did in high school. I was the dork again, right? Mm-hmm. So I dorked out in rehab and reclaimed my life in 2004. Okay? Fast forward, not gonna go through the rest of my life cuz I [00:12:00] was 47 then. I'm 64 now. Covid was a thing. We all have talked about how Covid was a thing, right?

Covid was a real thing for me. Um, my three children were still, you know, travel bug people and they were like, Hey, Columbia's open, we'll go to Columbia. You know, all kinds of crazy external things. Not to mention I lost a really big job with money and benefits and all the things. And when you lose a job in your sixties, I gotta tell you it is not pretty because it, it's not easy out there.

I don't care what anyone says. It's a, you know, you're discriminated against. With age and I knew that. And so I was exponentially freaking out. And our community, our county in California was the first county to get the shutdown, the shelter in place order. There was no going anywhere. The impact of that, the impact of the people that I lost to covid, the impact of worrying about my [00:13:00] children, getting this thing that we thought everyone was gonna get and die from.

I mean that, you know, it just exponentially freaked me out and just ramped up the drinking like, you know, I'm not alone in this. I know, but, it was funny at first because my husband and I were joking about it and then eventually, a year later, we were vaccinated and things were getting better and whatever.

It wasn't funny anymore. And that drinking was definitely affecting the quality of my life. I was still unemployed. Um, that was a really good reason, right? I found Reframe. Yeah. Facebook ad. Thank you Facebook cuz I'm that girl, right? And I joined Reframe as a user. Um, and that was in December of 2021 and I eventually got another job.

Same kind of job that I'd been having that had been stressing me out. And that wasn't good for me for the last long time period of time, but I'd been a coach for 12 years and I had coached people, you know, as like my side hustle because [00:14:00] it's hard to get that going in the beginning and make it make an income, right?

So long story short, I lost another crappy job. I literally got the email while I was live on a reframe call and said, oh my God, I think I'm getting fired tomorrow. Everyone's like, what? That was the best thing that ever happened to me. And then on another reframe call, someone said, I want, I can't remember.

And I think it was you, Kevin, and if this was your question, please, please tell me. It was like, what is your "Why" and is it still valid or do you need to tweak it or uplevel it, or something like that. I really think it was your meeting. Yeah. And uh, and he said, take some time and think about it and you know, if it comes to you today, share it.

Right? So I was really mindful of that and I was thinking about it and I was like, oh, damn and I raised my hand and Kevin called on me and I started sharing it. And I started, you know, breaking down in tears because I said I am [00:15:00] no longer going to play small in my own life. And I, I had known this, Tara Mohr was a coach

she wrote the book, uh, a bigger game playing, you know, 'Playing Big' in your life. Mm-hmm. And she had autographed my book, she went to the same coach's training as I did. It's like, you know, I'd known this for so long, but it wasn't until that meeting that it was like the light bulb went off. So a couple of weeks go by and I'm unemployed again, and I'm like, oh my God, I'm a coach.

I'm gonna email Kevin. And I emailed Kevin and said, Hey, here's what I'm thinking. And he wrote back, Hey, let's do a zoom call. That's how I landed here. That was a way longer story than I anticipated telling.

Kevin: Uh, no, hey, it takes as long as it takes. Right. Thank you for sharing that. Uh, I, I do have some questions on, cuz you kind of you jumped, right? You Oh, I did jump. Yeah. And, and, and feel free to share, you know, whatever you want, but [00:16:00] how was it between, from 2004 to 2020? Like, how would you say alcohol showed up in your life then?

Heidi: So I did a year of sobriety, which I promised myself I would do after I got home.

Mm-hmm. And I, in my community, it was small. What they recommended for me was to go to co-dependence anonymous, no shock there. Um, and we didn't have a coded meeting. We had AA and na. Um, and so I chose aa. Uh, and you know, the pills were not necessarily narcotics. There were benzodiazepines and, you know, sleeping pills and whatever.

So I, you know, I'm actually allergic to na, narcotics and opioids. I think I said that to you, Kevin, cuz we share the, the back problem. Um, so I, that's a good thing, right? Yeah. Anyway, I, I found aa, um, To be the best place for me, cuz it was what was offered. And so I went, um, my, treatment was also based on the 12 steps.

So it was a natural progression [00:17:00] that's mm-hmm. What was going on, you know, uh, at the time. And, um, I enjoyed it, uh, to the extent that it's, it's one of those places that's not for me. You know, I'm one of those people, it's not for me. I don't believe that I'm powerless. I don't believe that anyone is powerless, really.

And so that was a thing for me. I also don't believe that we're all the same, right? So I ended up, uh, leading an evening women's group. Um, I ended up, I never sponsored anybody, but I did mentor one woman who just happened to be older than me. And, you know, when I dropped down to her, this truth, "Sweetie, we're not all the same".

She's like, oh, yes we are. Yes we are. She was really emphatic about that. And then I explained to her, you know, you play the piano, like Mozart, you're the only person in the room who does that. That makes you different. And somehow she could hear that. Right. You know, we're all on the same journey. That part makes sense, you know?

[00:18:00] But nobody's story is the same. Nobody's background is the same. No one's way of drinking is the same. So I did my year and then I figured out, you know, how to be a "normie", which is what they called it back then. Yeah. So I just carried on normally until Covid and things got nuts.

Kevin: So when you joined Reframe then, what was your thought like, okay, you got the, you got the Facebook ad, you clicked on it. Um, yeah, there's always, uh, those, those things always seem to show up. Like, I'm not saying that ad, but like, things like that always seem to show up when you're, when you need it, right. Because totally. Your brain's looking for it almost.

Heidi: Um, totally. I'm sure I was googling alcohol cessation. I'm sure that I was, you know, involved in some sort of, I love research, so I I don't remember now, but I remember I see that ad and I'm like, of course I see this ad. I'm gonna click on [00:19:00] that. You know, and, and then I, I downloaded the app, like, I, like, I'm interested, this cutback thing sounds cool to me.

That's what I wanna do.

Kevin: So I'm curious, like, what did that, that picture in your head in, I think December of 21, right? That picture in your head of how you wanted to be, um, what did that look like? And, and. And maybe compare that to how it is now, right? Like, cause I, you know, I was just talking the other day about how get rid of that, that image, uh, in your head about what you think your journey with anything, whether it's alcohol, whether it's some, something else, like what you think your journey looks like when you start, or, or along the way, is not what it's gonna look like.

Whenever you get to where you think, you know, to that place that you think you should be. Um, you know, it's gonna change. It, it, it could, you could get maybe the same result. Um, but it's, [00:20:00] it never really looks that way. The, the, the way we paint it, right? Because we don't know. We have to go through it and figure it out.

So I'm curious, you know, what your, what your vision was back then compared to let's say now.

Heidi: Yeah, so I, what I wanted back then was just to get back to what I considered homeostasis. Where, you know, I was not drinking daily and over-drinking and having brownouts and, you know, I wasn't blacking out, I wasn't passing out, I wasn't throwing up.

I, you know, it wasn't like that, but it was fuzzy and uncomfortable. And the next day I, you know, I felt awful. I mean, you already have brain fog when you're in your sixties anyway. Why add to that nonsense? You know, so, so what I wanted was a greater quality of life. And what I wanted was a program that had the steps and the systems in [00:21:00] place to guide me back to where I wanted to be or where I thought at the time I wanted to be.

It's not where I am now, but That's cool. Cause Yeah, you, during it morphs and then it's like, oh, I want more. You know? Yeah. So

Kevin: There's that growth, does that answer your question? Well, yeah. Um, you know, what, what do you feel? I guess if you'd like to share like, what your, what your journey, you know, I don't like to for, for anyone listening, there's probably people I know I used to do this too.

Like, how much was she drinking? What, hang on, what was she drinking? How much, when all, you know, there's all these questions that, uh, that come up and, and I, I think the, the, how much is, is not as relevant as, I mean, it can be in certain circumstances, but because whenever we say like, oh, I was drinking 10 drinks a night, or five drinks a night, or 20 drinks a night, whatever it is, like, we, we then immediately compare, right?

I

Heidi: have an answer too much, too often, too early.

Kevin: Yep. [00:22:00] Love it. Um, because Right, that's what's important. You know, it, it wasn't. Serving you in your life, right? It was absolutely, it was, it, you were, um, you hit your personal rock bottom back in the early two thousands it sounds like, and you hit you. You felt you either had, you know, and I, and rock bottom, I just feel is, is just relative to the person.

Right? Um, totally. And maybe you hit another one here and it probably looked different? Uh, but you got to that point where you're like, I, you know, I can't keep doing this. I need to do something.

Heidi: And I knew underneath it there was a root cause. Just like my failed marriage was the root cause of the anxiety and all of that initially, you know? Yeah. So I knew it's like, okay, this is, you know, this is not covid o's fault. There's something else going on. Right. And so the root cause as it turns out, was I was playing small in my own life. That I was in a career [00:23:00] choice that, uh, I didn't choose be because I wanted to do it. I chose it because it was good money and that was my goal.

And that's why one of the things that I coach on is, you know, don't work a shitty job if you don't have to, you know, get an exit strategy, get a new job. It's important, you know, to do work that we love. I, since motherhood, which was a full-time stay-at-home job for me mm-hmm. I have never had a cooler job than that until now. And now it's exciting and life is good. So I had a root cause again, right? Yeah. Yeah. I had another thing that I had to look at, examine in my life. Um, and that was it. Yeah. So I, I owe you a debt of gratitude, Kevin. I'm just gonna thank you right now for that meeting.

Kevin: Oh, and, and, and, and I love that because yeah, I mean, uh, yeah, as soon as you said, oh, how can you tweak it?

I was like, yeah, that's probably, that sounds like something I would say. Um, but no, thank you. And that's, and that's a, that's an important question because [00:24:00] that, that reason why we start out right is not static it changes. Now there, there could be that overarching reason that we do it but there's things that get added along the way that we pick up because as we work on ourself, as we work on this thing, then it's like, oh yeah, I didn't realize that I felt better when I do this or don't do that, or, you know, I didn't realize this, you know, as, as, as we work on ourself, these things come up and add those in, add those in to the reasons why you're doing this thing. Um, it's important to, for motivation for, for all of that. Um, so I like the, the so too, uh, let me see if I got this right.

Too much, too often, too early. Yeah. Uh, and how would you, what phrase or or comparison analogy would you give? When my husband?

Heidi: Yeah. Well, yeah. Oh, compared to now. Oh. Um, what

Kevin: would be the [00:25:00] phrase, uh, compared to that? Let's see.

Heidi: Uh, never early, never too much and never too often. That's it. There you go. That's it.

I know. And, you know, everybody has their own, uh, Version of what a successful cutback track looks like. Yeah, right. Um, and we can segue into that because that's one of the things that I wanted to, to chat about with you today, Kevin. Um, having been on the track and knowing a lot of the people and working with different coaches at Reframe, I might add, um, has, you know, given me a real depth of experience around, um, other people's journeys as well as, you know, root causes as well as the need to be alcohol free as well as the inspiration of those people who have gotten there and in a way that I can't even imagine.

And the courage and the the [00:26:00] Sticktuitiveness and all of the things, you know it is just being involved in that really shaped how I downloaded the information that I was getting from the app, how I synthesized the information that I was getting during the meetings, which were so critical for me.

I went to meetings every day. I started, they were half hour segments as you recall, Kevin. So I started out on the cutback meeting, then I'd re log into the Zoom and I'd listen in, um, and not participate in the alcohol free meeting cuz that's how it was designed. But you learned so much being, you know, yeah.

And I just, I just kept at it every day, every day, every day. And it was part of my systematic approach cuz I love data, um, to literally measure and time and space and time the space in between the drinks, right? So my husband and I [00:27:00] had gotten to the ridiculous hour of 2:00 PM is okay cuz it's five o'clock in New York.

That was during Covid, right? So yeah, first, the first level was. Three o'clock on the timing right, and then down to four and then down to five, and then I pushed it way out until I did alcohol free days. But a, a slow step down progression, I knew from my personality type was the way to do it. It's the slow and steady wins the race, right?

Mm-hmm. I'm gonna be the tortoise in this situation, right? I'm gonna take it really slow and be really mindful about it. Honestly, that was a huge piece. Uh, I know all about mindfulness. I've been on the planet. I didn't realize what I was doing was mindful, but you know, yeah. At the time I didn't label it as such, but it was so measuring incrementally and making those small changes each day.

I kept a log on the table that I could fill out the timing and then I'd space it and then I'd add water, um, [00:28:00] or anything na in between. And I made sure that I wasn't hungry, of course. Um, you know, I would have dinner at a regular dinner time. I wouldn't drink before dinner ever. That was just the first thing I put in place once I got it down to, to the dinner hour 5:00 PM for mm-hmm.

For my husband and I were earlier over here, but, but the point is it took me months to get to the point where I added in my first alcohol free day. I did it so slowly, but it also for me was great because it was no big thing. My biggest fear was not sleeping that night cuz I'm one as a little kid that I have an overactive brain and.

Sleeping was always a thing for me. And then I thought, okay, what's, because I did 10 nights in rehab without sleeping, you know, it's like I've been there, it's pretty damn awful. But I lived so on that first alcohol free night when I was just so terrified to go lie in bed and think that I wasn't gonna fall asleep.

It's like, okay. So [00:29:00] that's the worst thing that's gonna happen here. You're not gonna sleep. Yeah, but you're not gonna die. You're just not gonna sleep. Maybe you'll be tired tomorrow. Yeah. You'll have more coffee in the morning. Right? I slept. Not well. Wasn't great, you know, but I slept. Right. So that was the big first hurdle that several months leading up to the alcohol free day.

And then I realized, okay, that didn't suck at all. In fact, that was kind of fun, you know? It was a challenge for me. I love a challenge, right? So I kept building upon that particular track record, and I was working with Nikita at the time. And, you know, it was then two in a row and then three in a row. And the thing that she told me, which I tell all my clients now, is, if you're gonna do one alcohol free day a week, make it the same day each week, because that lays down a neuro pathway in your brain that says it's Sunday.

You don't drink on Sunday. And [00:30:00] pretty soon it's not a thing on Sunday. And I'm here to tell you it's not a thing on Sunday because it just goes away. And it doesn't even matter if I go out on a Saturday night, there's no way I'm gonna overdo it. There's no way I'm gonna wake up feeling crappy. There's no way I'm gonna, you know, knock 'em back on Sunday.

It's just, it's, it's not a thing. But it took a long time for me to get there, and that was my particular way of doing it. And then I have used that same methodology for folks like me, whom I coach. Um, and some people they need the rigid structure, you know, whatever. Yeah. But having this, if you will, relaxed titration off of alcohol over time, I never had intense cravings.

I never had the mental machinations. Um, because I always made it available to me. I [00:31:00] didn't have to take it out of the house. Again, this is just my journey. Not everyone can do this, and I fully understand that. Um, so,

Kevin: because with that, I was gonna ask like Yeah. On that point, like, not everybody can do this.

And um, I agree picking a day, you know, or, or days or whatever, um, to say like, I don't drink on Sunday. Every Sunday. I don't drink because if you don't do that, You're sitting there thinking like, okay, I'm gonna have one alcohol free day this week. What day is it gonna be? Oh, it's gonna be Thursday.

And then what happens when something pops up on Thursday and well, I'll just do it on Friday, and then Friday comes and you're stressed from the week. And then, you know, it, it's, it's all that anxiety, all that guesswork that kind of comes in with that. But my question is, is like, well, what if I, what if someone invites me to brunch on Sunday?

What do I do? Like what if it's a, I don't know. I, the, uh, Stanley Cup finals are going on right now, and the NBA is, I think, still going on. Right? So, um, you know what, if there's a game on Sunday and, and I, and I always drink at the [00:32:00] game, like, can I do that? Know

Heidi: what if Stephanie Graff comes back and plays tennis again?

I'm gonna have to drink on that. No.

Kevin: Yeah, no. But like, you know, that's, that's the, that's the thought. So, so what's some advice that you tell people, like if they wanna stick to that day? Um, What do you do?

Heidi: It's really easy. It's your day. You just stick to it.

It doesn't matter where you go. It doesn't matter what the event is. It doesn't, it, it doesn't change anything unless on your successful cutback track, there is an event that's happening on a Sunday, let's just say a wedding. My son happened to get married on a Sunday. It was cheaper. It was a budget move, right?

Yep. So they got married on a Sunday, right? And one of my goals early on in Reframe was to be a good mother of the groom. That was like one of my very first "Why's", and I shared that, you know, and they got married. So I started in 2021 and they got married in, oh, there were two going to be getting married, I should say, [00:33:00] in August of 2022.

But that didn't happen, um, because of the damn covid. Yeah. Right. They, you know, they people were not gonna come. It's long. Doesn't matter. Yeah. The point is, ultimately they got married on a Sunday, and that was at that time, a day that I wasn't gonna drink, but I let myself have a glass of champagne as a toast when we toasted the bride and groom.

Mm-hmm. And so I broke that rule on that one Sunday, but that's part of my cutback journey now, is I can throw that in and it's not gonna wreck it for me.

Kevin: Right. Yeah. I think it's a good tool to have in mind, right? That, that every one, that day, a week or that, that consistency, I'll say, I don't wanna limit it to a day.

I don't want to, you know, guide people into any specific direction. But having that consistency is a good thing to add in if you need it. I mean, [00:34:00] it's looking at your cutback journey, looking at your journey to reduce alcohol in your life. Uh, you know, whether you're cutting back to cut it out completely or just cutting back to a certain amount or however you approach it.

Um, you know, knowing these tools, these levers that you can pull. Uh, you know, maybe you do that in the beginning and say, okay, I get to an alcohol free day, or a certain number of drinks, or whatever. And then, um, after a while you can be more flexible because you're working on it. But, uh, but go ahead and continue, uh, you know, with how you approach.

Heidi: Yeah, so, so that, you know, systematically what I do now when I'm working with uh, a client on, on cutback is I tell them about my approach. I talk about my approach in the meetings too, but I, you know, I go more in depth in, in detail on how it works. So the way it works and is working, [00:35:00] and I have to say, I have a lot of fabulous clients and many of them have been with me since I started coaching, uh, around the 1st of March so we're in June now, a couple of months and have made amazing progress on my cutback track. You know, I coach alcohol free people as well. They are making amazing progress too. I've got folks that aren't making amazing progress. I got all of that.

But yeah, I wanna address the cutback thing. So we sit down in a meeting, um, either a zoom call or we structure some sort of way of being on the phone so that we can talk, you know, face to face, whatever we, we, you know, to, to set the plan initially, right? Mm-hmm. So it's where they are and where they wanna go, what their current goal is, what that looks like, and then how do we back into that, right?

And for a lot of people having an a f D in the beginning, alcohol free day is not gonna fly and I was one of 'em. So I have a lot of respect around that. Yeah. So, [00:36:00] you know, let's just. Talk numbers here, because you have to talk numbers with an individual on the broad thing, we don't need to talk about it, but, so I'll just make this a random example.

10 drinks a night every night. That's the starting point, right? Where do you wanna get to? I wanna be able to have one or two drinks, and I, I only wanna really drink socially. I don't wanna drink at home alone. Okay, great. So 10%, when someone's drinking 10 drinks a night, that's a, you know, 70, you know, 10% is seven less.

That's, that's a one a night, right? Mm-hmm. It's not a big, it's not a big increment really. You know, it's not, it's not hard. So I start out with them if they're not ready to go down to nine in the beginning, then we do this, we, I write out the week in my notebook, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday.

And whatever day it is, I'm like, okay, it's Tuesday today. [00:37:00] And I'll say to them, what, what do you wanna do tonight? Well, I wanna have the 10. Okay, cool. 10 is good, nine is better. And I do a 10 slash nine on my note. How about tomorrow? Same. Okay, 10 is good, nine is better. And then eventually we get to a day where they're like, okay, I think, you know, after five or six days of doing this, I can do nine good, nine is good, eight is better.

And we literally carry on. And then I look at the app and I look at their, my phone, and I have their drink totals. And I check on the daily how they're doing. And some of them, You know, kind of limp along and struggle a little bit. And then we regroup and we, you know, we back up and start over and figure it out again.

Or we add something different or we take something out, we talk about what might be the trigger, and if we can take out a trigger, then we're, we're going somewhere. Right? And that's a big part of that too. So that's super individual. Then I have [00:38:00] really, really excited, ambitious clients who go, literally, this is no joke from tens and nines to sixes and fives in the span of 10 days.

They just really cut back and they're doing great. And then they fast forward another month and they're doing threes and twos, and then twos and ones. Then they have to go on vacation. This is like, how do I go on vacation? I'm going on a cruise. Okay, let's talk about that. And then we, what's legit?

How do you wanna feel on vacation? How do you wanna show up? If you're going with your family or you, you know, you're going with a group, how do you wanna be, you know, is this going to be a trigger? We go through all of those things. Each individual has their own things. Cause vacation is a trigger going to the airport trigger, you know, so we walk through all of that and set up a, typically a separate plan for vacation so that they don't come back from [00:39:00] vacation and feel like they screwed up their whole program.

They come back vacation going, that was vacation. This is home. And that has been incredibly successful. And you know, people are vacationing now, I've got a lot of clients doing this. They're touching base with me on the daily. I did this last night. I'm good. I, you know, I didn't no day drinking. That's the other rule on if you don't want a day drink, I at home, I highly recommend you don't day drink on vacation.

They make amazing mocktails, you know, they'll put the umbrella in. Yeah, it's all good. But I try to keep it as consistent with home as possible when it comes to timeframes. Right. That's super important. You don't want to creep back up.

Kevin: So sounds like, uh, you know, good advice, like they tell you for sleep, right.

To keep your bedtime. Yeah. And, and wake times consistent. It's totally very, you know, because your body gets used to that and your bo it, it helps your body Yeah. Get used to that or, or sleep better. So same [00:40:00] thing, keeping those timeframes consistent so you're not all over the place and you come home and you're like, okay, it's, it's two o'clock and this is, this is what I've been doing for the last seven days.

Yeah. Um, yeah.

Heidi: Yeah. That's just, you know, it is like sleep hygiene. It's the same thing. It's, it's keeping it real, you know, getting the adequate and, and you know, and you know, we all know that if you have one at noon, you're never going to. Make your number last until into the evening on a vacation. You're just like, that's not gonna happen.

You know that. Yeah. That's so, yeah. And, and so that, you know, part of it and then the buy-in, you know, and then let's face it, not everybody's buy-in is a hundred percent when you first start talking about the plan, right? So there's some flailing around, there's some slips, there's some getting mad at themselves and, and all of that stuff.

And I'm like, yep, I get it. But what's gonna serve you most, what's gonna serve you now is reassessing, reevaluating, [00:41:00] re-looking at root causes, triggers, um, urge surfing, a craving like is so important. You know, I played that damn numbers game, Kevin, on. So addictively, I gotta add. Cause it was a challenge

Kevin: 2048.

Yeah. Yeah.

Heidi: And uh, I had to break up with that game eventually cuz it was, that was a challenge. But, um, anyway, but that was how I got from two to three, from three to four, from four to five, you know. And, uh, it, it was the one thing that I did and I also kept it to one thing. I know a lot of people do a lot of things to get through that hour of the day or go for a walk or go exercise or whatever.

But for me, consistency is key, uh, for me to repeat behaviors over and over and over again. Um, [00:42:00] and I think it's just like going to school if I. Pay attention in class. If I take notes, if I read by notes, and if I study for the test, I will pass the test.

Kevin: So with consistency, um, yeah, I was curious, I was gonna ask this before, but, uh, you know, pushing that back from, on your own journey from, from two to three, from three to four, like what, what did you do?

You know, did you just play 2048 or, you know, what tools did you, uh, use to pushback and, and, you know, what worked, what helped you? Uh, again, knowing that everybody is different as far as what works and what's what they wanna do, what the, what, you know, kind of, uh, resonates with them and all that.

Heidi: Oh, totally. Yeah. So I used 2048 when it got really hard. That's when I, I busted out the 20. It took my mind to a another place because it was challenging and I needed something difficult [00:43:00] to focus on. Right. Yeah. And so I watched the office did,

Kevin: I needed to distract myself and I Yeah. Watched the office. I remember you, I did that.

Heidi: I remember you saying that. Yeah. Um, so I did useful things. I did simple things, laundry, dishes, uh, you know, I had another dog at the time, walking the dog. Um, you know, I did all of those things. Um, I

Kevin: Did you plan those tasks at that time? Did you save 'em for that or, or do you just. You, you had enough to do that.

You could always just do it. No,

Heidi: no. I, so I, my hours of effectiveness are in the morning. I'm smart in the morning. I've told you this, Kevin, I'm not very smart after two in the afternoon. I'm just not. So I wake up at four in the morning. I'm on fire at five. I had 6:30 AM Wake Up Reframe this morning. All good for me.

So I always push those tasks to the end of the day because I don't need to use my brain for them. I can fold laundry without being smart. Right. [00:44:00] Doesn't matter. Yeah. So it was a fallow period in my day. So if that is a creative period in your day and you are a creative who drinks through the creative process, that is tricky.

That is a very tricky, it's a very different scenario. I'm not gonna go into all the nuances right now. Yeah. But for me, that's my fallow period of the day. So it also made it easier to drink because I never, ever drank to get anything done ever. I didn't drink to study. I didn't drink to do a project. I'm a writer.

I didn't drink to write. I couldn't do those things if I were drinking. Mm-hmm. Right. Oh, and I think I left out a very important thing about my journey. The very first thing I gave up when I started my Cup back journey on reframe was weed. Cuz I'm a California girl, we smoke weed. I haven't smoking weed for decades.

Right. But I realized [00:45:00] early on in reframe that smoking weed was a trigger. Right. It made me want to drink more. So on one given day, early in January of 2022, I made the big decision to quit smoking weed and everyone was jaw dropped. Like, you, you don't smoke weed. And I haven't smoked weed in a year. What do you mean?

Like, so it's been a year and a half now and uh, I just gave it up and it was the smartest thing I ever did because that also made me dumb. You know, I don't need anything to make me dumb. So, yeah, that's gone Anyway, back to this fallow period. It's easier for someone who doesn't need to get things done to drink during their fallow period if they're wanting to be fallow, which I was.

And it's harder for people to give up drinking during their creative time and their working time if that's how they, you know, cause then, you know, I've got, you know, one person who's like, I, my, [00:46:00] my creative juices are on fire since I cut back and, you know, put in these long stretches of, of alcohol free days.

I, I'm just writing like, it's, it's incredible opposite experience for someone who's gone a very prolonged period of time, alcohol free, can't find that writing spark. Can't, you know, It doesn't mean you change your journey, it means it's gonna come back. It's just not there yet. You just keep Yeah. Working on what you're working on.

So that's how I got through that, Kevin. I, I did useful things and when it got really rough, I played that silly game until I didn't need it anymore. Until it was a pattern that I was talking about before I had this new way of not drinking and I had this new way around mindfully drinking that came about, that felt familiar to me as the years before Covid, you know, that felt comfortable.

That felt safe. Yeah, that [00:47:00] felt doable. So,

Kevin: Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. That's the, uh, um, especially too about like the creative process, that example, right? Like, we have to basically solve for different things. I'm, I'm not gonna say problems, but you know, it could, you could frame it that way, but we have to solve for how our lives are structured.

Right. Um, because we, if we're trying to change something about it, like, okay, well if I always write in the afternoon, if I'm a writer and I always write in the afternoon, I always start drinking that. Okay, well how can you change that? How can you fix that? Um, and you know, I could sit here and say, well, we'll just write in the morning.

But if you're like, no, it's not, you know, it, it's, it's solving for that and thinking through ways to do it. What were you gonna say there?

Heidi: Yeah. Well, I was just gonna say, because I know from real life experience, I have a girlfriend who was a writer. She's also a night owl, but morning pages, the [00:48:00] artist's way, you get up and that's the first thing you do. You do three pages of free writing before you do anything. You can start the coffee, you can have a cup, you can zip off the coffee, but you have to get up and do that. And she trained herself when she was finishing her first book to get up at five o'clock in the morning, press the button on the coffee, and that got her out of the block.

And you don't write about what your story's about or what your, you know, her case, it was a memoir. You write about whatever's in present in your mind, and you just get that out on paper. So for creatives, in particular writers, you know, yeah try it, change it up. Don't Yeah. You know, need to drink in the afternoon to write, get up in the morning, read the book, and do it differently.

That's what Reframe's all about. Like yeah. Learn about yourself and figure out how to do it differently, whatever that means.

Kevin: Yeah. Because it's not going to, That first time you wake up and you do that when you've never done it before, it is not gonna [00:49:00] feel good. It's not gonna feel right.

Right. But that doesn't mean that it's not going to work eventually, or that doesn't mean that it's not helpful, you know? So I think there's that, there's that thing that we, we try and change, but it's awkward and it's uncomfortable and it's, and we kind of sometimes have a tendency to, I know I did, to, to write it off and be like, no, that's not gonna work.

Like, I can't do that. Um, and, and I just give something up because it didn't feel right. But it doesn't feel right for a reason because we're used to doing it, you know, one way. Um, yeah.

Heidi: Yeah. It's hard growing pains. Yeah, man. It's, you gotta, yeah.

Kevin: You gotta strike. There's no way around it. Right. You have to work through that.

Um, Unfortunately but, but our brains are, are efficient machines, right? They, they want to create those neural pathways that, hey, this is how we do it and this is how we've always done it. And, and this feels right. So to change that it takes laying down new pathways [00:50:00] repeatedly over and over again.

You know, maybe not for the same if you did that for 20 years, it's not gonna necessarily take another 20 years to change, but it's gonna take some time. No.

Heidi: Yeah. Yeah. And that is the thing, time is on our side, right? You know, we, if we set out on a journey and we know we have to be alcohol free, and we stop and start and have several day ones and day eights and day 20 sevens and day whatevers, you know, it, it is not the end of you being able to achieve your goal of alcohol free.

It is always the beginning of the part of you that's going to have this be successful. Right. And it is so possible to do this with the support of the Reframe community. I don't believe is nearly as possible if at all possible to do this on your own, [00:51:00] right? And that was one of the things that, you know, I wanted to talk about today because the community support that I had, the coaches that I had, the different perspectives of the different coaches. We didn't have as many coaches back then, but it was so cool to go to all the different meetings cuz they all had different stories, different perspectives, right? And the meetings were tiny. Like it was a big meeting if there were 40 people, you know, in the beginning that was a big meeting and now we have this greater community and it's morphed into its own essence, if you will, of how people are coming to these meetings, realizing the incredible safe space and support to drop down your truth, right? Like to be able to do that, the opportunity to listen [00:52:00] to how other people have done it, to their story, to what has happened, um, and have that available is so mind expanding and at the same time, so comforting. And when people have been on the app for a year, and this has happened this week, and they're like, I don't know what, why I've been here a year and I just started coming to meetings.

These meetings are amazing. And it's like game changer, right? Yeah. And I went to the meetings from the get-go. It was one of the things I was the best at. And I think it jump started me in a way that I wouldn't have gotten if I just had gotten scholarly and started doing all the reading and, you know, bought all the books and, you know, all those things.

I, you know, I, I really focused on how others were doing that. I really focused on the variations and the similarities and I really synthesized that material. Um for the better part of a [00:53:00] year before I really felt solid enough to reach out to you, Kevin, and say, Hey, I think I can do this.

Right? Yeah. And so that part of it, the community, um, and what we shared this morning, because I was, I, the topic for this morning was, um what are your, or any, uh, unexpected gifts of being on Reframe. And there were so many beautiful words, and I have a little bit written down here. I'm gonna, um, read from this list.

This one is one of my favorites. Trusting that I know who I am, trusting myself again, you know, this just kept coming up and it was so cool. Peace, just calm. Peace. You know, life is so not crazy anymore. Like that. That was a, a reoccurring [00:54:00] theme. Purpose. Purpose came up and I raised my hand in my little Hollywood Square because boy did it give me purpose.

Yeah, purpose, uh, learning all the learning, you know? Yeah. Not just the cool science and everything, but all the other extra extraneous good stuff. Learning. And then this was my favorite one when it came up and it was learning what it is to be non-judgmental. Being in this community is learning what it is to be non-judgmental.

And I just said, oh my God, this is the Gandhi moment, you guys, the Gandhi moment, be the change you wanna see in the world. And what I segued from was a woman saying, can you imagine? What it would be like if the world was like, what it's like to be in a Reframe community meeting. Right? [00:55:00] Yeah. Incredible stuff.

Like it is otherworldly. I know that sounds really hokey, wonky, but it, but it is like, you know, it, there's so much peace and harmony and there's so much goodness. And even when someone's sharing something hard and you know, horrific and, and you know, it's not all like that. Obviously there are days that are bad and hard and, you know, I cry in meetings whether I'm the moderator or not, you know, things hit us and, and, life gets shitty and goes sideways, right?

Yeah. But we can feel safe there and I think that's huge. And I know that changed my world completely. Really. Yeah. So,

Kevin: Those are amazing. Um, and, and, You don't find that right when you're doing it on your own, when you're just gritting through it and, and doing that, that's where having that community, having [00:56:00] those, you know what, whatever that looks like to you, right?

Yeah. Whether, you know, cuz there's so many, there's so many different communities, programs, all that stuff out there and it's about finding that one that works for you, but also like, you know, how can connecting with other people that came up today in my meeting, um, you know, connecting connection is so helpful in times of stress and so helpful in times when you're struggling, when we isolate, that's obviously when things like alcohol can be that thing that helps us in that isolation until it doesn't, right?

Yeah. Um, But you know, cuz you know, I always joke that my meetings were audiobooks. Uh, cuz I didn't have Reframe when I started, uh, my connection was with a therapist. Mm-hmm. I tried for so long to change on my own, and I needed, I, I knew I needed [00:57:00] some sort of connection, uh, to somebody.

And, you know, that's, that's how it came. And, and it worked for me, right. I mean, I could have done that and been like, well, no, this person's awful. Um, she's not, I still talk to her very often. Um, you know, and, and that works for me. But, uh, yeah, hearing other people's stories in just podcasts and audiobooks and in that connection, but, you know, doing it live or doing it in a, in a forum or on social media and having that where you can support someone else. And, and while supporting yourself, you know, is huge, uh, it's a, it's a invaluable part of the journey. And, and, and sometimes it's a lot of, you know what a lot of people are missing. Um, I know. I was.

Heidi: Absolutely. Yeah. And people don't even realize it until all of a sudden they're like, okay, this now, this suddenly like, you know, clicked.

Right. And since I did it from the beginning, I didn't know any differently. But those people that are now coming [00:58:00] in and saying, I just found these meetings and decided to check it out, and it, it's like, game on and then from that a lot of people come into meetings, then they get a coach, they take it to the next level.

Yeah. They start. You know, double downing on what they're working on with true accountability. They get into groups if they're not coaching, but they get into small accountability groups whatever that is it's bigger than you. It's more than you, right? And you know, on our best day we might not need a ton of support.

Right. But every day is not our best day. Life happens, right? Yeah. So the consistency of the support, the continuity of the support is huge. And I just know that from touching base with my clients on a regular basis, whether I just send them a voice memo, you know, after I look at their, uh, at their, you know, their drink log, you know, and those are for people obviously on the cutback track and, and, and sometimes my people on the alcohol free track log a drink or two and then, [00:59:00] and then we talk about it, you know?

Yeah. I mean that's, that's the other thing. Um, yeah.

Kevin: Yeah. Cuz just because you're on the alcohol free track doesn't mean that you're alcohol free. Right. That, that could, that's what you're working towards. Yeah. Um, and when you're on the cutback track, that doesn't mean you're cutting back to. Keep it in your life.

Either that could mean cutting back to quit. Uh, so, you know, it's kind of, yeah, it could, it could mean a lot of different things. It just matters. What does it mean to you and which, you know, which makes sense for you. Uh, exactly. You know, choose accordingly, right. Um, exactly. Yeah.

Heidi: And the organic nature, uh, for folks on the cutback track of adding multiple alcohol free days has led to all these cool outcomes.

Like, I just randomly decided to go alcohol free 57 days ago, and here I am. That's a real number that came out in, in a meeting, right? Yeah. Um, I decided, you know, boundaries weren't good for me, for my [01:00:00] personality. So when I. Decided to do dry ish January. I, you know, I gave myself the freedom and space to do it one day at a time and see how far I got.

And I had a group, my hubs, my bestie, and my hubbies bestie before of us were all doing it together. My bestie dropped out on day three. My husband dropped out on day five. My husband's bestie and I were together for two solid weeks. Then he bailed and I was on my own. Yeah. But it was fine because I had my accountability people.

I had my group. I had that going for me. Right. And so, it doesn't matter what others are doing around you, you can always find support here at Reframe. Yeah. It's solid

Kevin: Yeah, the dry ish. Now, wait, now, now it's called damp, right? Damp January. Or I think it's not my word. I know, I I, it's funny, I've embraced it at this point, [01:01:00] but cuz I don't think it's going anywhere, but yeah, that's the, uh, yeah, yeah.

You know, it, it's, it's not a dry January or, or dry month. It's a, it's a damn month and it's, yeah. You know, and there's value in that though, right? Because Sure. You just, you just said it and, and it's, I think recognizing that, uh, obviously progress over perfection and all that doesn't, you know, there's that obvious piece of anything that we do in life.

Um, totally. But why, you know, it, it's cuz I would do that, like, I would say, oh, I'm doing dry January, or I'm doing sober October or whatever, and I would drink four days in and then I'd be like, well, months over. Right? But if I would've approached it like, Okay. The month isn't over. Like, okay, I, I had a drink or I did whatever on, on that day.

I can still come back tomorrow. Um, and if you're, if you're doing a damp or a dry ish or, you know, whatever, like there's no need to fall off. Right. It's just keep working on it and focusing on progress. Yeah. Uh, [01:02:00] just like you said about vacation, whenever, you know, you have people who, uh, obviously go on vacation and, and it's different than home, but how does it compare to previous vacations?

You know, oh, you drank six or seven, what would you have drank before? Oh, 14. Like, yeah. You know, look at the progress there that, that you're making now. Don't beat yourself up because you were drinking two or three at home and now you're drinking six or seven. Make that same comparison apples to apples.

Heidi: Exactly. Exactly, and it, it, you know, it is working. I'm watching it on the daily work with the clients that I'm coaching. And it's so inspirational, it's another thing, you know, and then they get to this point and then they wanna up level, they're like all right so one of my clients was like, I'm not going to drink on the same, I'm gonna have the same a f d on vacation. A lot of them give up the a f d just, you know, cuz they wanna like feel into the vacation and be [01:03:00] organic and I'm fine with that. But those that are like, oh yeah, no, I, you know, I'm, I'm sticking with my Sunday, Monday, even though that's two days of my five day vacation.

And, and what's really cool is like, you can have a really good time without drinking. It's so much fun. Yeah. It, it, it, you know, when you, when you have that first experience of really going somewhere and enjoying it and knowing that you can have a good time, uh, like at a wedding, like I can sit at a bar and order food and watch sports on TV and I don't have to have a drink.

I'm not triggered. I'm lucky that way. I'm not saying that's for everyone, but you know, when you can start doing these things, Out in the world, um, that used to be hard or, you know, whatever, but you've figured out how to grow that muscle, how to make that not a trigger and get past that. Um, it's a milestone, right?

It, yeah. It's, you know, it's, it's success. So everybody's [01:04:00] path is different. Everyone's definition of success is different. And, and we honor that here and that's what I love about being here and, and being with people here that I can give all of that to when I'm coaching them. It's like, you get to, do you, that's my favorite thing to say.

You do you. Right. And in about eight minutes I'll be starting a meeting where I'll probably say that once or twice.

Kevin: That's a good, uh, good reminder for me. Thank you. Um, and, and, and you know, I, I think that's important too, to challenge yourself right to, to. Say, you know what? I'm on vacation. I'm gonna keep that alcohol free day that I'm doing because see what it's like but don't look at it as like, you're depriving yourself or, or I'm gonna go to this concert, I'm not gonna drink. Uh, you know, don't look at it as depriving it yourself. Flip it like, what are you gaining by doing it? Like gonna feel better tomorrow on your day off on or day on vacation. You're going to remember the music more.

You're not gonna stand in line [01:05:00] for the bathroom as much. You're, you know, all those things. Like what are you gaining from doing that? And, and challenging yourself just to show yourself that you can do it too. Yeah. Um, experience it, experience things in a different way than you always have.

Heidi: Yeah.

Yeah. And it carries over. This is one of my favorite stories. I had one client that just came back from vacation and said, a, this is the first time I've ever lost weight on a vacation. B. I didn't go over my number, I didn't up, you know, I didn't drink earlier, I didn't do anything other than what I would've done at home and I feel amazing.

And it carried over into this person's, uh, behavior around buffets free food, essentially. You know, we all know that free is a trigger, open bar trigger, you know, all those things, right? Yeah. And in this case it was an all-inclusive, right? So, didn't do that either. Yeah. So stuck to the [01:06:00] same exercise routine as home, stuck to the same drink routine as home, stuck to the same eating as home and came home after a very long vacation having lost some weight.

Kevin: Yeah, it's one of my favorite new swings. Win, win, win. Yeah. That's awesome. Right? And it's Like recognizing that that person didn't just start, you know, and some people listening like, well, I can't do that. I don't feel that, like, you know, that person just worked on themselves and, and got to the point where they were able to put that together.

So if you're not there yet, don't feel discouraged, you know? No. Or that it's just it's working on something and being honest with yourself as far as what your journey looks like and reevaluating it along the way. Um, yes, I know, I know you mentioned to, to sort of wrap up, cause I know you, I know you gotta go.

So, you know, I know you mentioned like measure timing and, and space them out. I know that was a, uh, a tip for that, but, you know, is there anything else you'd [01:07:00] like to leave, uh, for people as far as how to approach their cutback journey, uh, or their journey here, period? Because there's overlap, right?

I mean, between anyone's journey. Yeah.

Heidi: I like what you just said too, Kevin, because in the beginning I decided to do diet, exercise and cut back all at the same time, and that was hard. And yeah, Nik Nikita's like, let me know how that works out for you. Yeah. Yep. So Kevin's absolutely right. You guys start with your mindful drinking journey.

Start with your alcohol-free journey, if that's what you've chosen. Start with your cutback journey, if that's what you've chosen. The mindfulness piece is huge. We use the word all the time in meetings. It bleeds out into the rest of your life in a really good way, right? And then you can add things in and adding things in is the reward for cutting things back or cutting alcohol out, whatever that is for you. So you feel good enough to add in a little [01:08:00] exercise, you feel good because you're already naturally losing a little weight because you're not drinking as much or you're not drinking at all. Right. And then, you know, you look at your nutrition like, oh, you know what, I, you know, I can add in more fruits and vegetables.

It's like the adding in of the healthy things Yeah. Is a direct result of the taking out of the unhealthy habits. Yeah. I it, you know, it correlates so beautifully. So yeah. Measuring, finding someone with whom you can be accountable when people aren't ready to share their, what they've chosen with their spouse or partner or besties yet, that part is hard in the beginning.

Find those people here that will help you become successful eventually. If you can share that with the people close to you, that's another layer. Um, that bec can become really supportive. It can also become unsupportive. That can be the case too. Yeah. Um, with your people, they're not, they want the old you back.

Right. So you just hang out with us [01:09:00] until you get more comfortable doing what you're doing and that, you know, becomes less of a factor. There's so much, Kevin, we can talk for another half an hour about this, but join the meeting to find out, join the meeting and find out. No, I really appreciate you, um, making this time for me to, to share.

I hope that what I appreciate, appreciate you will help.

Kevin: Yeah, no, I appreciate what, what you've shared and, and, and how you've, uh, given this advice and, and just again, E everyone's different, right? So giving people ideas to find their own journey, um, and to work on that. So thank you very much for that, Heidi.

Um, if you'd like to share, you know, where people can find you, if it's just Reframe or anywhere else, please uh, feel free

Heidi: to answer. Well, you can find me Reframe. Um, I'm getting better about leveling up my social media. I do have, uh, an Instagram account. It's, it's new to me and it's not very, there's not a lot going on there yet, but it's [01:10:00] called You're gonna love this Live more, drink less.

So I'm at Live More, drink Less on Instagram. Love it. And yeah, and, and it reframe all the time. So that's where you can find me. I've written a couple of chapters in women's empowerment books if you're interested in those. Hit me up. Um, one of 'em talks a little bit about my rehab, so that's kind of fun too.

Get your piece of my story in a, in a book.

Kevin: Awesome. That's exciting. Uh, well thank you so much for being on the podcast today and really appreciate it. And thank you everyone for listening, and we'll see you again soon.

Heidi: Thanks, Kevin. Have a good rest of your day.

Kevin: You too.

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